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| As I can see, per our conversation yesterday I need to get you out of town.
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Group: Forum Members
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riverman (3/13/2008)
As I can see, per our conversation yesterday I need to get you out of town.Yep....I even started looking this morning. It would be terrible to end up being a full time bartender. Talk to you later // Don
Designated Observer *****Counseled & Advised by Bup, The Adventure Dog***** 1473552 - 556329  (no longer using uShip for loads)
****************************** SEMO Motor Transport Service
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Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 2/18/2008 2:39:43 AM
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| 1 Mean Dog Thank you so much for all the help, and all the other guys pertaining to the questions I might be raising on this forum or in the e mails. I greatly appreciate all the assistance. Like I started my 1st thread on this post, "I jumped ship into this car hauling business", and I am learning as I progress. I believe if i had wanted to research 1st, I was gonna be very scared about the requirements and would have backed out. But now that I am in, I gotta make it work. With all your help fellow operators, I believe I will make it. To move a mountain, you start by moving small pebbles. We already there. I am already feeling the crispy greenbacks in my hands already. lol....lol...lol...lol...lol... If He is for us, who will be against us?
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Group: Forum Members
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ALPHASTOCK (3/11/2008)
If us haulers can stick together and reject the low offers we are given, then we shuld be fine.That is a mouth full and I do agree! What is low though? I started a thread in "Business & Operations" called "Rates- Only you can prevent cheap freight" but did not get the response I had hoped for. (You did reply) I wanted to get a conversation going about what we should all expect for our services.
~ Hotshot Transportation Co. ~ ...and I see a truck stop sign ahead, so I change lanes... I need a cup of coffe and a couple dollars change... USDOT 1553028  MC 576750
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| This forum or thread has had some good info. Here's a unique one for you. I've got a 2003 Dodge 3500 with the HO and six speed. I'm purchasing a Wally-mo 4car belly load trailer to pull behind it. Now, I don't intend to haul for hire. Only personal. I collect a particular type of car in Michigan and intend to haul them west to my parents ranch to store. I find them minus a motor/engine and pick them up for $100 or so. I use them for parts cars. Truck: GVWR 11,500, GCWR 21000. Trailer: GVWR 20,000 (I think, may be slightly higher) Now, nearly every thing I read on Michigan, Illinois, Iowa and South Dakota, given I'm hauling personal property for myself, not buisness related, I don't need a CDL. However, I'm concerned about the weight. Looking at federal regs, I won't even begin to touch the per axle max rating of 20K/axle or 34K for duals. But here are where my questions are: I'm told by a michigan DOT helpline, because I don't haul for money, I don't need stop at the scales. Is this true? or Should I stop anyway? If I do roll through a scale, could I get fined for being over GCWR of the truck? (I realize it's stupid, not reccommended and unsafe) For instance, the trailer weighs 7,800. The truck weighs 6,800. So, this leaves me, by the book, with 6,800 to haul for vehicles. (merely two midsize) Typically, these parts cars would be on the order of 8,000. For this one an only time, I'd like to take 3 parts cars and throw on my old 1/2 ton to take home for the ranch which would be 9,600. So, trailer weight (assuming 100% loaded vehicle weight is on the trailer) to be 17,400. This is under the GVW of the trailer by 2,600. However, this is over the GCWR of the truck by 3,125. Can I get a ticket for being over the GCWR, but under the GVWR of either the truck or trailer seperately? Again, this is hauling for myself and not in a buisness manner. Any insight would be helpful.
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Group: Forum Members
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nksvals (6/25/2008)
This forum or thread has had some good info. Here's a unique one for you. I've got a 2003 Dodge 3500 with the HO and six speed. I'm purchasing a Wally-mo 4car belly load trailer to pull behind it. Now, I don't intend to haul for hire. Only personal. I collect a particular type of car in Michigan and intend to haul them west to my parents ranch to store. I find them minus a motor/engine and pick them up for $100 or so. I use them for parts cars. Truck: GVWR 11,500, GCWR 21000. Trailer: GVWR 20,000 (I think, may be slightly higher) Now, nearly every thing I read on Michigan, Illinois, Iowa and South Dakota, given I'm hauling personal property for myself, not buisness related, I don't need a CDL.......That information is incorrect. There are a few situations where you would not be required to have a CDL such as hauling certain agriculture commodities, military exceptions, and state/local government employee exceptions....but for the most part you will require a CDL when the CGVWR is over 26,000 lbs. Whether you're hauling personal property or hauling for hire or not doesn't impact the requirement for a CDL in your situation. However, I'm concerned about the weight. Looking at federal regs, I won't even begin to touch the per axle max rating of 20K/axle or 34K for duals. But here are where my questions are: I'm told by a michigan DOT helpline, because I don't haul for money, I don't need stop at the scales. Is this true? or Should I stop anyway? Every state establishes their own rules for operating scales and what vehicles must stop. In most states, there is a posted minimum weight stating which vehicles must pull through the scales. In MO, for example, it is 18,000 lbs. Usually all commercial vehicles are included regardless of weight. But not being commercial doesn't exempt you from going through the scales. If I do roll through a scale, could I get fined for being over GCWR of the truck? (I realize it's stupid, not reccommended and unsafe) For instance, the trailer weighs 7,800. The truck weighs 6,800. So, this leaves me, by the book, with 6,800 to haul for vehicles. (merely two midsize) Typically, these parts cars would be on the order of 8,000. For this one an only time, I'd like to take 3 parts cars and throw on my old 1/2 ton to take home for the ranch which would be 9,600. So, trailer weight (assuming 100% loaded vehicle weight is on the trailer) to be 17,400. This is under the GVW of the trailer by 2,600. However, this is over the GCWR of the truck by 3,125. Very unlikely unless you have obvious unsafe conditions. Although it is not a good idea to exceed the manufacturer's recommended towing weight, it is not illegal in the US. Don't try it in Canada though. Can I get a ticket for being over the GCWR, but under the GVWR of either the truck or trailer seperately? Again, this is hauling for myself and not in a buisness manner. Any insight would be helpful. Again, very unlikely, but if an enforcement officer happens to see something else wrong and checks the GCVWR against your actual scaled weight and axle weights.......you'll likely get a citation for that also.Essentially, you'll be subject to all the FMCSA regulations that the commercial haulers are except you'll not be required to have a Motor Carrier authority (MC#). But if you routinely transport even your own property across state lines in the furtherance of any commercial enterprise.....you would need a US DOT number. You can register with FMCSA for the USDOT# for a private property carrier and there is no fee.
Designated Observer *****Counseled & Advised by Bup, The Adventure Dog***** 1473552 - 556329 (no longer using uShip for loads) ****************************** SEMO Motor Transport Service
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Group: Forum Members
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1MeanDog (6/25/2008)
nksvals (6/25/2008)
This forum or thread has had some good info. Here's a unique one for you. I've got a 2003 Dodge 3500 with the HO and six speed. I'm purchasing a Wally-mo 4car belly load trailer to pull behind it. Now, I don't intend to haul for hire. Only personal. I collect a particular type of car in Michigan and intend to haul them west to my parents ranch to store. I find them minus a motor/engine and pick them up for $100 or so. I use them for parts cars. Truck: GVWR 11,500, GCWR 21000. Trailer: GVWR 20,000 (I think, may be slightly higher) Now, nearly every thing I read on Michigan, Illinois, Iowa and South Dakota, given I'm hauling personal property for myself, not buisness related, I don't need a CDL.......That information is incorrect. There are a few situations where you would not be required to have a CDL such as hauling certain agriculture commodities, military exceptions, and state/local government employee exceptions....but for the most part you will require a CDL when the CGVWR is over 26,000 lbs. Whether you're hauling personal property or hauling for hire or not doesn't impact the requirement for a CDL in your situation. However, I'm concerned about the weight. Looking at federal regs, I won't even begin to touch the per axle max rating of 20K/axle or 34K for duals. But here are where my questions are: I'm told by a michigan DOT helpline, because I don't haul for money, I don't need stop at the scales. Is this true? or Should I stop anyway? Every state establishes their own rules for operating scales and what vehicles must stop. In most states, there is a posted minimum weight stating which vehicles must pull through the scales. In MO, for example, it is 18,000 lbs. Usually all commercial vehicles are included regardless of weight. But not being commercial doesn't exempt you from going through the scales. If I do roll through a scale, could I get fined for being over GCWR of the truck? (I realize it's stupid, not reccommended and unsafe) For instance, the trailer weighs 7,800. The truck weighs 6,800. So, this leaves me, by the book, with 6,800 to haul for vehicles. (merely two midsize) Typically, these parts cars would be on the order of 8,000. For this one an only time, I'd like to take 3 parts cars and throw on my old 1/2 ton to take home for the ranch which would be 9,600. So, trailer weight (assuming 100% loaded vehicle weight is on the trailer) to be 17,400. This is under the GVW of the trailer by 2,600. However, this is over the GCWR of the truck by 3,125. Very unlikely unless you have obvious unsafe conditions. Although it is not a good idea to exceed the manufacturer's recommended towing weight, it is not illegal in the US. Don't try it in Canada though. Can I get a ticket for being over the GCWR, but under the GVWR of either the truck or trailer seperately? Again, this is hauling for myself and not in a buisness manner. Any insight would be helpful. Again, very unlikely, but if an enforcement officer happens to see something else wrong and checks the GCVWR against your actual scaled weight and axle weights.......you'll likely get a citation for that also.Essentially, you'll be subject to all the FMCSA regulations that the commercial haulers are except you'll not be required to have a Motor Carrier authority (MC#). But if you routinely transport even your own property across state lines in the furtherance of any commercial enterprise.....you would need a US DOT number. You can register with FMCSA for the USDOT# for a private property carrier and there is no fee. Thanks for the input. It's greatly appreciated. I will only do this once a year when I travel home on vacation. In 15 years, I've only ever sold 2 cars. So, it's by no means a commercial enterprise. Here's how Michigans regs read, straight from their site: | Who Needs a Commercial Driver License (CDL)? | Any Michigan resident who intends to operate the following commercial vehicles is required to have a commercial driver license: Single Vehicles - Having a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR)* of 26,001 pounds or more. Combination Vehicles - Towing a trailer or other vehicles with a GVWR of 10,001 pounds or more when the gross combination weight rating (GCWR)** is 26,001 pounds or more. Vehicles:
*Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) is the recommended maximum total weight of the vehicle and load as designated by the vehicle manufacturer. The GVWR label is usually found on the driver side door post of the power unit and on the front left side of the trailer. The GVWR should not be confused with the elected gross vehicle weight (GVW) which is declared by the vehicle owner for registration purposes. **Gross Combination Weight Rating (GCWR) means the value specified by the manufacturer as the maximum loaded weight of a combination vehicle. In the absence of a label, the GCWR can be calculated by adding the GVWR of the power unit to the GVWR of the vehicle(s) or trailer(s) being towed. Exemptions The following people do not need a CDL: Active Duty Military (including National Guard): With military licenses operating military vehicles. Police Officers and Firefighters: Meeting approved training standards and operating authorized emergency vehicles. Farmers: Operating vehicles within a 150 mile radius of their farm. An F-endorsement is needed by farmers operating combination vehicles whose towing vehicle has a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more. A knowledge test, but no skills test, is required to obtain the F-endorsement. However, farmers who carry hazardous materials in amounts requiring placarding while operating combination vehicles whose towing vehicle has a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more, or a single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more, need a CDL with a hazardous materials endorsement.
Individuals: Operating motor homes or other vehicles used exclusively to transport personal possessions or family members, for non-business purposes.
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As I see it, I fall under the last paragraph. More questions regarding the weight. Again take note of the following: Truck: GVWR 11,500, GCWR 21000. Trailer: GVWR 20,000 The trailer can load 4 vehicles. Say I load one that is 3500lbs, and three that are 2000lbs each. The trailer weighs 7,800 lbs. So for simlification, assuming 100% of the weight is on the trailer, the total of the weight is: 17,300. I'm under the rating of the trailers 20,000 GVWR. I'm also under the FMCSA regs for axle weight which are 13,500 steer, 20,000 rear of dually, and 34,000 for trailer tandems. (I'd be at 3400 front, 3400 rear and 17,300 for the trailer again, assuming 100% of the trailer/load is on the trailer, which we know is not true but for worst case scenario) However, adding up my load/truck, my GCW is 24,100. Again, my listed GCWR of the truck is 21,000. I'm 3,100 over. Am I in violation of any laws? Illeagal in any manor? Can I be written up on this? (Again, I realize it's dangerous, not reccommended, and really stupid, but for discussions sake we'll assume my scenario) In general, the scales, do they require any vehicles over xxxxxx amount to pass through? In general, do I need to roll through the scales? Thanks to any an all who reply/answer my questions.
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Group: Forum Members
Last Login: 2/23/2006 12:17:56 PM
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nksvals (6/26/2008)
1MeanDog (6/25/2008)
nksvals (6/25/2008)
This forum or thread has had some good info. Here's a unique one for you. I've got a 2003 Dodge 3500 with the HO and six speed. I'm purchasing a Wally-mo 4car belly load trailer to pull behind it. Now, I don't intend to haul for hire. Only personal. I collect a particular type of car in Michigan and intend to haul them west to my parents ranch to store. I find them minus a motor/engine and pick them up for $100 or so. I use them for parts cars. Truck: GVWR 11,500, GCWR 21000. Trailer: GVWR 20,000 (I think, may be slightly higher) Now, nearly every thing I read on Michigan, Illinois, Iowa and South Dakota, given I'm hauling personal property for myself, not buisness related, I don't need a CDL.......That information is incorrect. There are a few situations where you would not be required to have a CDL such as hauling certain agriculture commodities, military exceptions, and state/local government employee exceptions....but for the most part you will require a CDL when the CGVWR is over 26,000 lbs. Whether you're hauling personal property or hauling for hire or not doesn't impact the requirement for a CDL in your situation. However, I'm concerned about the weight. Looking at federal regs, I won't even begin to touch the per axle max rating of 20K/axle or 34K for duals. But here are where my questions are: I'm told by a michigan DOT helpline, because I don't haul for money, I don't need stop at the scales. Is this true? or Should I stop anyway? Every state establishes their own rules for operating scales and what vehicles must stop. In most states, there is a posted minimum weight stating which vehicles must pull through the scales. In MO, for example, it is 18,000 lbs. Usually all commercial vehicles are included regardless of weight. But not being commercial doesn't exempt you from going through the scales. If I do roll through a scale, could I get fined for being over GCWR of the truck? (I realize it's stupid, not reccommended and unsafe) For instance, the trailer weighs 7,800. The truck weighs 6,800. So, this leaves me, by the book, with 6,800 to haul for vehicles. (merely two midsize) Typically, these parts cars would be on the order of 8,000. For this one an only time, I'd like to take 3 parts cars and throw on my old 1/2 ton to take home for the ranch which would be 9,600. So, trailer weight (assuming 100% loaded vehicle weight is on the trailer) to be 17,400. This is under the GVW of the trailer by 2,600. However, this is over the GCWR of the truck by 3,125. Very unlikely unless you have obvious unsafe conditions. Although it is not a good idea to exceed the manufacturer's recommended towing weight, it is not illegal in the US. Don't try it in Canada though. Can I get a ticket for being over the GCWR, but under the GVWR of either the truck or trailer seperately? Again, this is hauling for myself and not in a buisness manner. Any insight would be helpful. Again, very unlikely, but if an enforcement officer happens to see something else wrong and checks the GCVWR against your actual scaled weight and axle weights.......you'll likely get a citation for that also.Essentially, you'll be subject to all the FMCSA regulations that the commercial haulers are except you'll not be required to have a Motor Carrier authority (MC#). But if you routinely transport even your own property across state lines in the furtherance of any commercial enterprise.....you would need a US DOT number. You can register with FMCSA for the USDOT# for a private property carrier and there is no fee. Thanks for the input. It's greatly appreciated. I will only do this once a year when I travel home on vacation. In 15 years, I've only ever sold 2 cars. So, it's by no means a commercial enterprise. Here's how Michigans regs read, straight from their site: | Who Needs a Commercial Driver License (CDL)? | Any Michigan resident who intends to operate the following commercial vehicles is required to have a commercial driver license: Single Vehicles - Having a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR)* of 26,001 pounds or more. Combination Vehicles - Towing a trailer or other vehicles with a GVWR of 10,001 pounds or more when the gross combination weight rating (GCWR)** is 26,001 pounds or more. Vehicles:
*Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) is the recommended maximum total weight of the vehicle and load as designated by the vehicle manufacturer. The GVWR label is usually found on the driver side door post of the power unit and on the front left side of the trailer. The GVWR should not be confused with the elected gross vehicle weight (GVW) which is declared by the vehicle owner for registration purposes. **Gross Combination Weight Rating (GCWR) means the value specified by the manufacturer as the maximum loaded weight of a combination vehicle. In the absence of a label, the GCWR can be calculated by adding the GVWR of the power unit to the GVWR of the vehicle(s) or trailer(s) being towed. Exemptions The following people do not need a CDL: Active Duty Military (including National Guard): With military licenses operating military vehicles. Police Officers and Firefighters: Meeting approved training standards and operating authorized emergency vehicles. Farmers: Operating vehicles within a 150 mile radius of their farm. An F-endorsement is needed by farmers operating combination vehicles whose towing vehicle has a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more. A knowledge test, but no skills test, is required to obtain the F-endorsement. However, farmers who carry hazardous materials in amounts requiring placarding while operating combination vehicles whose towing vehicle has a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more, or a single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more, need a CDL with a hazardous materials endorsement.
Individuals: Operating motor homes or other vehicles used exclusively to transport personal possessions or family members, for non-business purposes.
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As I see it, I fall under the last paragraph. More questions regarding the weight. Again take note of the following: Truck: GVWR 11,500, GCWR 21000. Trailer: GVWR 20,000 The trailer can load 4 vehicles. Say I load one that is 3500lbs, and three that are 2000lbs each. The trailer weighs 7,800 lbs. So for simlification, assuming 100% of the weight is on the trailer, the total of the weight is: 17,300. I'm under the rating of the trailers 20,000 GVWR. I'm also under the FMCSA regs for axle weight which are 13,500 steer, 20,000 rear of dually, and 34,000 for trailer tandems. (I'd be at 3400 front, 3400 rear and 17,300 for the trailer again, assuming 100% of the trailer/load is on the trailer, which we know is not true but for worst case scenario) However, adding up my load/truck, my GCW is 24,100. Again, my listed GCWR of the truck is 21,000. I'm 3,100 over. Am I in violation of any laws? Illeagal in any manor? Can I be written up on this? (Again, I realize it's dangerous, not reccommended, and really stupid, but for discussions sake we'll assume my scenario) In general, the scales, do they require any vehicles over xxxxxx amount to pass through? In general, do I need to roll through the scales? Thanks to any an all who reply/answer my questions. I suppose you can interpret it any way you want and the use of the term CMV does cause some confusion. However, once you start crossing state lines you can kiss the Michigan rules good bye. Then you're under the federal regulations. Classes of License: The Federal standard requires States to issue a CDL to drivers according to the following license classifications: Class A -- Any combination of vehicles with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds provided the GVWR of the vehicle(s) being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds. Class B -- Any single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds, or any such vehicle towing a vehicle not in excess of 10,000 pounds GVWR. Class C -- Any single vehicle, or combination of vehicles, that does not meet the definition of Class A or Class B, but is either designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver, or is placarded for hazardous materials.
Designated Observer *****Counseled & Advised by Bup, The Adventure Dog***** 1473552 - 556329 (no longer using uShip for loads) ****************************** SEMO Motor Transport Service
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